Transcript for Harvard Professor’s Masterclass on Machiavelli | Harvey Mansfield

An Interview with Harvey Mansfield on Machiavelli

 0. Introduction

Johnathan Bi: We underestimate just how important Machiavelli is. At best, we consider Machiavelli to be just a clever political commentator, and at worst, we consider him to be an immoral schemer that can be easily dismissed. My guest, Harvard's Harvey Mansfield, has spent his entire career trying to show that Machiavelli is so much more, that he is the very founder of modernity, in fact, responsible for establishing the very world you and I live in. Machiavelli, according to Mansfield, is not just the founder of modern ethics and politics, but the true father of modern science itself. In Mansfield's estimation, Machiavelli's chief rivals are no less than Plato and Jesus. Machiavelli is the Antichrist, and we are his heirs. Machiavelli started a silent revolution, one that was purposefully hidden. In the next two hours, then, Professor Mansfield will reveal to us all its secrets.

 1. Machiavelli's Chief Enemy: Christianity

Johnathan Bi: I want to spend this interview understanding what it means for Machiavelli to be a founder of modernity, but before we talk about what he founded, let's talk about what he was against, beginning with Christianity. In your books, you called Christianity Machiavelli's chief enemy. Why is that?